Difference between revisions of "Mail Management/Meeting Notes 2017-07-17"
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| − | + | ==== Meeting Notes ==== | |
| − | + | ===== Alternatives to E-mail ===== | |
| − | + | * Aren't we all on [https://slack.com/ Slack] by now? | |
| − | + | ** Slack has some free options, also paid ones | |
| − | + | ** eg. voice and video options | |
| − | + | ** E-mail threads have messages and reply text, but slack has just the continuous stream-of-consciousness | |
| − | + | ** Bots: "What's my schedule on Thursday?", "Bot, book me lunch with Kirk on Tuesday" | |
| − | + | *** Regular expression bots, "human in the loop" bots, and "IBM Watson" hyperintelligent bots | |
| − | + | *** Bots really made it, turned Slack into a marketable product (opened the platform, API) | |
| − | + | ** But whatever happened to Google Wave and Google Buzz? | |
| − | *** | + | ** Is there a Slack-to-Email bridge? Maybe on Rocket.Chat |
| − | + | *** Privacy and datamanagment concerns: who stores your chats? streams? e-mail? | |
| − | + | ** Spammers on Slack? It's a closed environment, you know your spammer (unlike e-mail) | |
| + | ** But there can be public "Talk to a sales rep" windows | ||
| + | * [https://www.kik.com/ Kik] also opened their platform | ||
| + | * [https://rocket.chat/ Rocket.Chat] - "Slack-alike" | ||
| + | ** web client & phone apps | ||
| + | ** e-mail gateway, LDAP gateway | ||
| + | ** Drag'n'drop filesharing | ||
| + | ** Self-hosted, on Ubuntu as a Snap | ||
| + | ** Self-hosted, so you have control over your own data | ||
| + | ** [https://kwvoip.ca kwvoip.ca] may set this up... | ||
| + | * XMPP - Cisco bought Jabber.com (now [http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/products/unified-communications/jabber/index.html Cisco Jabber]) | ||
| + | * [https://matrix.org/ Matrix] / [https://about.riot.im/ Riot] | ||
| − | + | ===== Ease-of-Use ===== | |
| − | + | E-mail is so easy to use, people use it for everything | |
| − | + | * File storage | |
| − | + | * Instant messaging | |
| − | + | * Archival storage | |
| − | + | * Operating System? | |
| − | + | ** Heard of people who use git as a mail repository | |
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| + | ===== Difficulty-of-Admin ===== | ||
* Struggle with Exchange and Outlook | * Struggle with Exchange and Outlook | ||
** Weird problems, eg. indexes | ** Weird problems, eg. indexes | ||
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** Would weird problems like indexing exist on Office365? | ** Would weird problems like indexing exist on Office365? | ||
| − | *** | + | * Large systems are constrained only by the time and effort of the SysAdmin |
| + | ** Or sufficient funds to purchase vendor support | ||
| + | ===== Spam Mitigation ===== | ||
* Large mail providers silently drop some mail, receivers and senders have no idea it's not delivered | * Large mail providers silently drop some mail, receivers and senders have no idea it's not delivered | ||
| + | * Need to bring mail filtering inhouse | ||
| + | ** Opinion that the only effective filters are Bayesian filters on content, not geo-blocks, IP-blocks, or domainname-blocks | ||
| − | * | + | * [https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7489 DMARC] and [https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6376 DKIM] (both broken for mailing list use) |
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* Dealing with blocklists | * Dealing with blocklists | ||
** Blocklists are reputation managers | ** Blocklists are reputation managers | ||
** Small orgs sending mail are incorrectly identified as spammers | ** Small orgs sending mail are incorrectly identified as spammers | ||
| − | ** Blocklist | + | ** Blocklist providers have no incentive to lift blocks based on the requests of senders (otherwise every spammer would make that request) |
** Recipients of failed messages need to contact their mail providers to stop the mail providers from subscribing to bad blocklists | ** Recipients of failed messages need to contact their mail providers to stop the mail providers from subscribing to bad blocklists | ||
| + | ** Filter provider needs to hold the spam for subsequent retraining (problems with privacy and data control) | ||
| − | + | * Organizations block access to external mail providers | |
| − | * | + | ** (block ports for SMTP:25, MSP:587, IMAP:143, &c.) |
| − | * | + | ** Must use smarthosts on ISPs |
| + | ** Web clients to read/send e-mail from external providers | ||
| + | *** [https://www.horde.org/apps/webmail Horde] | ||
| + | *** [https://squirrelmail.org/ Squirrel Mail] | ||
| + | *** [https://roundcube.net/ RoundCube] | ||
| + | *** [https://apps.nextcloud.com/apps/mail Nextcloud mail app] (based on Horde) | ||
* New legislation for mass-mail (starting 1 July 2017?) | * New legislation for mass-mail (starting 1 July 2017?) | ||
| + | ** [http://fightspam.gc.ca/eic/site/030.nsf/eng/home Canada's Law on Spam and Other Electronic Threats - Home - Canada's Anti-Spam Legislation] | ||
** Mailing lists? OK for non-commercial organizations that don't sell or solicit funds. | ** Mailing lists? OK for non-commercial organizations that don't sell or solicit funds. | ||
** Fundraising? OK as long as there is a paragraph in the message that this is for fundraising. | ** Fundraising? OK as long as there is a paragraph in the message that this is for fundraising. | ||
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| − | + | Back to: [[{{BASEPAGENAME}}]] | |
| − | [[Category: | + | [[Category:KWNPSA Meeting Notes]] |
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Latest revision as of 14:53, 1 August 2018
Contents
Mail Management
- Date
- Monday, 17 July 2017 from 7:00pm to 9:00pm
- Event Announcement
- https://www.meetup.com/NetSquared-Kitchener-Waterloo/events/240752492/
- Location
- Communitech Jelly Bean Room 1st Floor, 151 Charles Street West, Kitchener, Ontario Map
Is e-mail obsolete? If not, how can we provide e-mail services to our Non-profit organizations? Do we treat internal, staff e-mail differently from our clients' e-mail? How do we communicate with large groups? What mailing list services are there? Do we just give all our e-mail to Google and Microsoft? Maybe we can use the e-mail from our ISPs? They advertise "unlimited mailboxes", right? Do we run our own e-mail servers? But then, how do we deal with spam, blocklists, and e-mail providers that don't play fair? And, is it "E-mail" or "Email"?
KWNPSA is in the process of setting up our own e-mailing lists, and we have plenty of e-mail system administrators in the group. Looking forward to a lively Round Table discussion!
--Bob Jonkman & Marc Paré
Meeting Notes
Alternatives to E-mail
- Aren't we all on Slack by now?
- Slack has some free options, also paid ones
- eg. voice and video options
- E-mail threads have messages and reply text, but slack has just the continuous stream-of-consciousness
- Bots: "What's my schedule on Thursday?", "Bot, book me lunch with Kirk on Tuesday"
- Regular expression bots, "human in the loop" bots, and "IBM Watson" hyperintelligent bots
- Bots really made it, turned Slack into a marketable product (opened the platform, API)
- But whatever happened to Google Wave and Google Buzz?
- Is there a Slack-to-Email bridge? Maybe on Rocket.Chat
- Privacy and datamanagment concerns: who stores your chats? streams? e-mail?
- Spammers on Slack? It's a closed environment, you know your spammer (unlike e-mail)
- But there can be public "Talk to a sales rep" windows
- Kik also opened their platform
- Rocket.Chat - "Slack-alike"
- web client & phone apps
- e-mail gateway, LDAP gateway
- Drag'n'drop filesharing
- Self-hosted, on Ubuntu as a Snap
- Self-hosted, so you have control over your own data
- kwvoip.ca may set this up...
- XMPP - Cisco bought Jabber.com (now Cisco Jabber)
- Matrix / Riot
Ease-of-Use
E-mail is so easy to use, people use it for everything
- File storage
- Instant messaging
- Archival storage
- Operating System?
- Heard of people who use git as a mail repository
Difficulty-of-Admin
- Struggle with Exchange and Outlook
- Weird problems, eg. indexes
- Would weird problems like indexing exist on Office365?
- Large systems are constrained only by the time and effort of the SysAdmin
- Or sufficient funds to purchase vendor support
Spam Mitigation
- Large mail providers silently drop some mail, receivers and senders have no idea it's not delivered
- Need to bring mail filtering inhouse
- Opinion that the only effective filters are Bayesian filters on content, not geo-blocks, IP-blocks, or domainname-blocks
- Dealing with blocklists
- Blocklists are reputation managers
- Small orgs sending mail are incorrectly identified as spammers
- Blocklist providers have no incentive to lift blocks based on the requests of senders (otherwise every spammer would make that request)
- Recipients of failed messages need to contact their mail providers to stop the mail providers from subscribing to bad blocklists
- Filter provider needs to hold the spam for subsequent retraining (problems with privacy and data control)
- Organizations block access to external mail providers
- (block ports for SMTP:25, MSP:587, IMAP:143, &c.)
- Must use smarthosts on ISPs
- Web clients to read/send e-mail from external providers
- Horde
- Squirrel Mail
- RoundCube
- Nextcloud mail app (based on Horde)
- New legislation for mass-mail (starting 1 July 2017?)
- Canada's Law on Spam and Other Electronic Threats - Home - Canada's Anti-Spam Legislation
- Mailing lists? OK for non-commercial organizations that don't sell or solicit funds.
- Fundraising? OK as long as there is a paragraph in the message that this is for fundraising.
Back to: Mail Management
